Can have significant grounding and fact, analysis and reason
Take Glorfindel rather than Pippin in fellowship
Estel
Elrond talking this up during council
Trust this is the right thing to do
“faith” is sometimes used but Corey is going to avoid using it. Has too many associations and different meanings.
“trust” might be a better word
Estel = Trust
Stubbon Hope – Sam’s song in the tower. “In western lands..”
“I will not say the day is done, or bid the stars farewell”
The “Stars Forever Dwell” .. “Sam saw a while star twinkle for a while”
It doesn’t matter if we both dies, the shadow can’t reach the high beauty so the shadow will eventually lose
Trust in the Really big picture
Concerning Heroes – On the stair – “But so our path is laid”
Sam previously believed Heroes in stories were the kind of people who went out looking for them. Now understands they found themselves on a path that was chosen for them.
“But the people in it don’t know”
If they had turned back they would have been forgotten. Implies there were many others that had
The Unknown – on Stair after the above passage
Frodo opines that the people in a story don’t and shouldn’t know that what sort of the story he’s in.
It will change the story if the protagonist if the hero knew who it will turn out when they made choices.
Hope dies in Sam – Star of Mt Doom chapter – “But even as hope died in Sam”
Sam picks up he is in a sad story, from which he won’t come back
Doesn’t really fully accept that, thinks of the Shire and how he wants to see them. But his Amdir dies and he no longer hopes he will see them
But his Estel remains. He is walking the path because it is the path that has been laid for him.
Trust, what should be, shall be
Gandalf has a Suggestion – Shadow of the Past – Gandalf tells Frodo about the Ring
“There is only one way…”
How do you move the Ring from the Shire to Mordor?
“My only candidate for Ringbearer has failed to throw the ring into a fire” … “under the most optimal circumstances possible”
Gandalf knows that Frodo will fail – Amdir is low
Encouragement – Shadow of the past – There was more than one power at work
“Bilbo was meant to find the ring, and not by it’s maker”
Gandalf tests Frodo to see how affected he is by the Ring. Results not encouraging
Follows Estel
Bedrock – “Shall prove but mine instrument”
You can choose what you role is in the story
Questions
Q: Hope vs Despair
A: Despair is for those who see the future 100% . But you can lose all your Amdir but still keep you Estel . But Denethor lost both while Sam above kept Estel
Q: Is Gandalf’s selection of Mary & Pippin in Fellowship same as selecting Frodo to take ring?
A: Yes. The signs have provided two candidates. “That probably is the path”
Missed a couple of questions cause I was googling for a comic someone mentioned.
Q: Tolkien is the master of Mindfulness
Q: The whole book we has readers we have to have hope all the way through
A: Trudi gave up FoTR because Gandalf died and not much book left. Didn’t want to read “That kind of book”. She had a failure of Hope.
“Is this a kissing book?”
“She was not conquered”: Morwen and Motherhood in Middle-earth with Ilana Mushin
Revisit 16-year old essay on Woemen in Tolkien
Mother of Turin, wife of Hurin, Daughter of Baragund
Sends Son Turin to Doriath but decides not to to accompany him
Long road, she is pregnant and safer with few in group
Hope Husband still alive
Would not take charity
Mother in Anguish, fingers bleeding as Turin leaves ( “Sorrows of Turin”)
Other scholars have noted that some of the problems of Turin are blamed on her
Often scholars are negative towards her
Tolkien and mothers
Tolkien lost mother early, often much read into this
Most left out of the story
Sometimes just genealogical
When acting as mothers sometimes they are sacrificing themselves
Later stories (and versions of stories) by Tolkien tend to have more women or expanded roles (eg Galadriel)
Morwen
She is present in the 1920 version, so not a product of later writing
Pride
More maternal desperation
Words and deeds rather than he imputed thoughts should be looked at.
To Enter the Perilous Realm or Not to Enter? That is the Question with Trudy Shannon
Our Tolkien heroes are always given hard choices and usually choose them
Aldarion and Erendis
Tolkien most explicit about Faery in “Smith of Wooten Major”
Aldarion
Think of Numenor has the land of humans and middle Earth as the Land of Faery
Aldarion goes to middle earth
After Aldarion returns he has grown in statue and his eyes look far away (similar to Smith). He cannot explain exactly what he saw (like Smith)
He keeps going back (Like Smith) and becomes a great fiend of the Faery King
Does not pass on his “passport” to faery directly
Erendis
Invited to middle Earth by Aldarion
She rejects the invitation immediately
Not open to possibility of adventure. No way she can walk this road
Remember Tolkien always gives his characters choices
Says she loves the Woods of Numenor. But late grows to hate their sight
Diamond
Given by Aldarion to Erendis
Taken as her Bethrothal gift
Not 100% obvious if it is magical
Not a happy ending
Withdraws from Kings count, moves away from trees, Stops wearing diamond
Unrecognised by other people
May have tried to reconcile with Aldaron or perhaps voyage to Middle Earth
Neither has a Fairy Story ending
Conclusion
Us here at Ozmoot may already be partially in Faery
Q: How does the star on the brown connect to Aragorn?
A: The Hobbits have a vision when they are with TomB, but it is a tradition that goes back to this story, but Tolkien is interested in how stories replay though the generations
Q: How autobiographical? Separate interests between Tolkien and his wife
A: More communication than seperate interests
Q: Are there more parallels to Aragon the Star wearer?
